| Author |
Topic |
Miss Moonwych
Formedian Shadows |
Posted - 2009.02.22 12:01:00 - [ 1]
Edited by: Miss Moonwych on 09/03/2009 05:52:36Update: all is now based on precise target sizes (no estimation anymore). Also fixed the grav rig bonus due to stacking. Update 2: added a new base class site (0.07%), Virtue implants added and changed to better name (Max strength). Update 3: Probes ranges have changed and their single probe strength is divided by 2. Keep in mind that multiple probe strength is double the single probe strength. Also the 82.2% penalty has been removed. Also added tip for determining the group a signature belongs to. --- Classifying signatures when searching for exploration sites and wormholes has now become harder due to the effect of skills/implants/rigs/launcher have on detected strength. I've created a small Excel file to calculate the max sig strength for different classes of targets. Max Target Strength Calc v0.4.xls ( alternative link) Here a screenshot ( link):  Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.As you can see you can fill in your own skills, implants and equipment. By using the numbers from the list you can determine which class of signature you are dealing with in a solarsystem. Keep in mind that these are maximum strengths: when the probe is on top of the target. If the probe is relatively far away from the target the site might appear to be of a lower strength, so its best to use the longest ranged probes (best is 256 AU now) or to move around the probe to see how high the strength gets. Why? Look here for what we aready could determine based on the base strength of a target. And here for the possibility that certain base strengths might indicate wormholes to unknown space (0.16% and 0.26%).  You can also estimate quite well how far away a probe is from a target if you know its class (determined by a larger probe). That way you don't have to rely (solely) on the highly deviating distance reported by the probe. Regards, M.M. Tip: if you use two probes around a planet (eg a probe above and below it) you only need a singe probe strength of 12.5% to see what group signatures belong to (you'll get 25% with the two probes). And in wormspace all "Unknown" signatures are wormholes and have a target size of 10 . |
Espoir
Trident Armed Forces
Republic Alliance |
Posted - 2009.02.22 12:36:00 - [ 2]
Edited by: Espoir on 22/02/2009 12:41:54
Good job - thanks alot.
Now I know that my Sister Launcher isnt completely useless.
But It's sad to see that you can probe down all but the 0,05 Sigs in a normal ship (no rigs, no imps, ...)
Makes the covops kind of useless :(
Lets hope the Wormholes will get an exclusive strength (like the red ones in your table) so we know if its a WH BEFORE we have to warp in.
Edit: Does the 121,65% rule change if you have 5 or 3 probes out? |
Cailais
Amarr
Diablo Advocatus
Rogue Elements. |
Posted - 2009.02.22 12:47:00 - [ 3]
Excellent work here - really good stuff: thanks :)
C.
|
Roemy Schneider
Vanishing Point. |
Posted - 2009.02.22 13:37:00 - [ 4]
i'm sure grav rigs mutiply, therefore 21% for two
and there's sister _probes_ in the LP store which are 10% stronger (i'm sure the deep space aswell and the extra 0.5 got shopped off in showinfo). with the ability to recover probes, i will buy them ^^ |
Miss Moonwych
Formedian Shadows |
Posted - 2009.02.22 13:41:00 - [ 5]
 Originally by: Espoir
Edited by: Espoir on 22/02/2009 12:41:54
Good job - thanks alot.
Now I know that my Sister Launcher isnt completely useless.
But It's sad to see that you can probe down all but the 0,05 Sigs in a normal ship (no rigs, no imps, ...)
Makes the covops kind of useless :(
Lets hope the Wormholes will get an exclusive strength (like the red ones in your table) so we know if its a WH BEFORE we have to warp in.
Edit: Does the 121,65% rule change if you have 5 or 3 probes out?
The "121,65% rule" applies if you use 2 or more probes. Its still being investigated how to prevent more penalty if your probe placement isn't done in a perfect tetrahedron. Btw: I just found my first 0.05% base site. Was kinda hard, but took the time and it worked: 0.05% - Pristine Serpentis Battle Remnants I printed out the excel file (with my own skills etc) and I think its quite useful to detect certain sites and to see how close you are already. Regards, M.M. |
Miss Moonwych
Formedian Shadows |
Posted - 2009.02.22 13:42:00 - [ 6]
Originally by: Roemy Schneider
i'm sure grav rigs mutiply, therefore 21% for two
and there's sister _probes_ in the LP store which are 10% stronger (i'm sure the deep space aswell and the extra 0.5 got shopped off in showinfo). with the ability to recover probes, i will buy them ^^
Thanks. I'll have to check that.  |
Bimjo
Caldari
SKULLDOGS
|
Posted - 2009.02.22 14:23:00 - [ 7]
The single most thread to sky rocket sisters launchers  (already got mine) |
Miss Moonwych
Formedian Shadows |
Posted - 2009.02.23 04:52:00 - [ 8]
Updated: all is now based on precise target sizes (no estimation anymore). Also fixed the grav rig bonus due to stacking. Thanks for the feedback Regards, M.M. |
DeepBlue
Cutting Edge Incorporated
RAZOR Alliance |
Posted - 2009.02.23 09:44:00 - [ 9]
Originally by: Miss Moonwych
Updated: all is now based on precise target sizes (no estimation anymore). Also fixed the grav rig bonus due to stacking.
Thanks for the feedback
Regards,
M.M.
lowest base sig ever found was 0.2. now to the point wich really worries me... virtue implants just became use less, with my maxed out char im just able to find everything - with or without virtues plugged in. ? thats why you didt bother to put the virtues on your sheet? :-) |
Miss Moonwych
Formedian Shadows |
Posted - 2009.02.23 11:43:00 - [ 10]
Edited by: Miss Moonwych on 23/02/2009 11:44:59 Originally by: DeepBlue
lowest base sig ever found was 0.2.
I scanned a system that contained a 0.03% site just before the effect of skills was added. And I found out (right after the patch) that it was changed to a 0.05% site. Not entirely certain it was exactly that site but the devs indicated that they "fixed" the problem of sites lower than 0.05% so I assume raising the sig to 0.05% was their fix. You could check the same constellation to see if this is correct. Originally by: DeepBlue
now to the point wich really worries me... virtue implants just became use less, with my maxed out char im just able to find everything - with or without virtues plugged in.
? thats why you didt bother to put the virtues on your sheet? :-)
One of the reasons I didn't add them yet is because they indeed seem to be irrelevant. I could still add them. Do you have details which ones etc? That would be helpful. As for my skills: the above screenshot shows the skills my character currently has on Sisi (also rigs/launcher/implants). Regards, M.M. |
Espoir
Trident Armed Forces
Republic Alliance |
Posted - 2009.02.23 11:46:00 - [ 11]
Originally by: DeepBlue
now to the point wich really worries me... virtue implants just became use less, with my maxed out char im just able to find everything - with or without virtues plugged in.
Yeah I hate this too. Now I can probe in a Battleship without Rigs etc.. Kinda weird... |
DeepBlue
Cutting Edge Incorporated
RAZOR Alliance |
Posted - 2009.02.23 12:04:00 - [ 12]
Edited by: DeepBlue on 23/02/2009 12:28:55i modified your table a bit, or simpy redid it. what you see on it, wich plex you can find and what skills/implants/ship/rigs you need to do so. red = you cant find green = you can find Scannable// UDPATE sheet updated, to represent the effects a bit better |
DeepBlue
Cutting Edge Incorporated
RAZOR Alliance |
Posted - 2009.02.23 12:08:00 - [ 13]
Originally by: Miss Moonwych
I scanned a system that contained a 0.03% site just before the effect of skills was added. And I found out (right after the patch) that it was changed to a 0.05% site. Not entirely certain it was exactly that site but the devs indicated that they "fixed" the problem of sites lower than 0.05% so I assume raising the sig to 0.05% was their fix. You could check the same constellation to see if this is correct.
if thats true, just remove the last line on my screenshot. however, this wont make it much better :( before it was not scannable at all, now it became scannable with some halfway good skills ... |
Bimjo
Caldari
SKULLDOGS
|
Posted - 2009.02.23 13:01:00 - [ 14]
sorry to be a pain in the a*** , I am not at home right now , Is probing working now? thanks and thanks Miss M for all your effort |
Miss Moonwych
Formedian Shadows |
Posted - 2009.02.23 18:19:00 - [ 15]
Edited by: Miss Moonwych on 23/02/2009 18:19:01 Originally by: DeepBlue
Edited by: DeepBlue on 23/02/2009 12:28:55
i modified your table a bit, or simpy redid it.
what you see on it, wich plex you can find and what skills/implants/ship/rigs you need to do so.
red = you cant find
green = you can find
...
// UDPATE
sheet updated, to represent the effects a bit better
Small but important note: you haven't taken the 82.2% multiplication penalty into account yet. If you do you (so everything below 121.65% becomes red) then for example virtues will enable someone with no covop (eg battleship) to find the hardest of sites. Not sure if thats very useful yet, but it makes them a bit more valuable.  Regards, M.M. |
DeepBlue
Cutting Edge Incorporated
RAZOR Alliance |
Posted - 2009.02.23 18:23:00 - [ 16]
Edited by: DeepBlue on 23/02/2009 18:31:37 Originally by: Miss Moonwych
Edited by: Miss Moonwych on 23/02/2009 18:19:01
Originally by: DeepBlue
Edited by: DeepBlue on 23/02/2009 12:28:55
i modified your table a bit, or simpy redid it.
what you see on it, wich plex you can find and what skills/implants/ship/rigs you need to do so.
red = you cant find
green = you can find
...
// UDPATE
sheet updated, to represent the effects a bit better
Small but important note: you haven't taken the 82.2% multiplication penalty into account yet. If you do you (so everything below 121.65% becomes red) then for example virtues will enable someone with no covop (eg battleship) to find the hardest of sites. Not sure if thats very useful yet, but it makes them a bit more valuable.
Regards,
M.M.
i did on a 2nd sheet, and its about the same. expect for the non cov-ops. thx anyway :) |
Roemy Schneider
Vanishing Point. |
Posted - 2009.02.23 19:06:00 - [ 17]
needs moar mentioning of sister core probes aswell ^^ |
Miss Moonwych
Formedian Shadows |
Posted - 2009.02.28 16:33:00 - [ 18]
Edited by: Miss Moonwych on 28/02/2009 16:33:42
Update 2: added a new base class site (0.07%), Virtue implants and changed to better name (Max strength).
Thanks for feedback.
Regards,
M.M. |
Miss Moonwych
Formedian Shadows |
Posted - 2009.03.09 05:35:00 - [ 19]
Edited by: Miss Moonwych on 09/03/2009 05:42:55
Update 3: Probes ranges have changed and their single probe strength is divided by 2. Keep in mind that multiple probe strength is double the single probe strength. Also the 82.2% penalty has been removed. Also added tip for determining the group a signature belongs to. |
Gnulpie
Minmatar
Miner Tech |
Posted - 2009.03.09 08:14:00 - [ 20]
Very nice. Excellent work! |
Nyota Sol
Center for Advanced Studies |
Posted - 2009.03.11 11:24:00 - [ 21]
excellent work. a big thanks to all the awesome exploration channel people. |
Espoir
Trident Armed Forces
Republic Alliance |
Posted - 2009.03.14 16:54:00 - [ 22]
Thanks for the work! I added it to a resource thread - hope this is ok :) |
Nice Devil
Amarr |
Posted - 2009.03.17 11:04:00 - [ 23]
\O ty a lot for your xls file
i'm missing the sisters probes
they have got 44 base scan strenght instead of 40 like standar t1 probes have got!
so 10% more strenght |
MailDeadDrop
The Collective |
Posted - 2009.03.22 20:08:00 - [ 24]
Is it still true that wormholes are size 10 objects? Because on a single test I ran on TQ last night, the kspace side of a wormhole had a signal strength matching the 6.67 size (for me), and the same wormhole on the wspace side had a signal strength matching the 5 size.
MDD |
Skywalker
Minmatar
Darkness and Chaos
INFINITY. |
Posted - 2009.04.08 15:03:00 - [ 25]
Is there any updated xls files around ?
|
Anastasy BL
|
Posted - 2009.04.09 12:45:00 - [ 26]
With the permission of the author slightly modified the calculator: The added option of strength probe - for the implementation of sister; Changed strength DSP :(; Now the backlight on the scanned areas. |
Skywalker
Minmatar
Darkness and Chaos
INFINITY. |
Posted - 2009.04.21 21:27:00 - [ 27]
Worth a bump
|
Rivqua
Caldari
Omega Wing
Snatch Victory |
Posted - 2009.05.06 07:59:00 - [ 28]
Why are the virtue implants specified as "up to 18.75%" when the Virue set bonus is 33.83% ? :)
Thankyou kindly! |
Rordan D'Kherr
Amarr |
Posted - 2009.05.08 09:59:00 - [ 29]
Good stuff, thanks. |
Tedric
Genco
Curatores Veritatis Alliance |
Posted - 2009.05.10 00:34:00 - [ 30]
Hi all,
Thanks to DeepBlue and Miss Moonwych for the number that sort of make sense to me.
I've been trying to use the .XLS sheet with the attached instructions on an earlier post that linked to it and failed :(
Sooooo...
To those of us who are metally challenged (its 1:30am here :/) would it be possible to add to that sheet a couple of cells were we hammer in numbers from a scan in EVE, then let a set of preset equations do there thing and have a number(s) pop out the other end.
For example, give it our skills info (already done). tell it we have launched a core probe, the results back are that it is blah AU away and the probe is on blah AU radius, tell it is of wibble% strength, then have it spit out the fact that it is a base flibble object?
tedric. |
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Max Target Strength Calc v0.4 (updated with new probe ranges)
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